Topic: Loose Frames/slides on used 1911/1911a1's

original: go2gb0.com
Retrieved: December 10, 2011
Last Post: October 26, 2005

1911crazy
October 24, 2005

I have been browsing the used 45ACP's and I'm seeing the frame rail rub marks on the front of the cutout on the slides. Is this the norm on some 45s? Or is it that they were hammered with no lube on the rails? I have been thinking of picking one up for a carry gun because their priced cheap and they wouldn't be a real collectable.


Mikey
October 25, 2005

Minor rattling between the frame and slide indicate the tolerances necessary for a reliable 1911. Those pistols were designed for dirty battlefield action and that's where the tolerances come in. I feel uncomfortable with a 1911 if the slide doesn't rattle a bit, but that's probably just because they match the rattles twixt my ears (lol).


Iowegan
October 25, 2005

Non-gunsmiths judge the quality of 1911s by how tight the slide fits the frame. Probably because they don't know much about how 1911s really function and the slide-to-frame fit could be checked easily without disassembling the gun. Over the years, this practice seemed to become a standard, though a very false standard. Even high-end 1911 manufactures began to make tight fitting slide-to-frame fits to satisfy unknowledgable buyers.

In reality, the slide, barrel, bushing, and of course the sights operate as a single unit, all locked together. The frame is nothing more than a platform to mount the slide. As such, the real accuracy issues are how well the barrel fits the lock lugs, the barrel's hood fits the breach face, and how tight the bushing fits the slide and barrel. When these parts fit snug, you will have an accurate gun.

A good example: I have a Les Baer that is very tight in all respects. It is an excellent shooter however, all it takes is a little powder crud and it starts to malfunction. I've found it has to be field stripped every 50 rounds to clean the rails and lugs. The measured vertical and horizontal play in the slide-to-frame fit is .002". My old Series 70 Colt has seen a gazillion rounds run through it. It has .020" horizontal side play and .012" vertical play in the slide-to-frame fit. It rattles like a BB in a freight car. The barrel fits the slide tight and it has a collet type bushing that also fits tight. That old Colt will shoot just as good as the Les Baer for accuracy and it never malfunctions, even after 250 rounds have been fired without cleaning.

Another characteristic unknowledgable people judge 1911s by is trigger pull. It is so easy to smooth and lighten a 1911 trigger that it's not an issue when buying a gun. If you don't have the talent to do it yourself, a compentent gunsmith can do it in a few minutes.

Another example: Last year I spotted a Randall A-231 1911 at a gun show. I asked the dealer what he wanted for it. He told me nobody had ever heard of this off-brand and besides the slide was a little loose and it had a horrible trigger pull. I took a look and found it to be in "like new" condition with the box and papers. He said he was trying to get $400 out of it. I didn't haggle a bit and smoked the cash on him. After I got the gun home, I went through it and cleaned it up. A little buffing and spring work and the trigger was a crisp 3.5 lbs. The Randall was a tack driver. I sold it a few months later for $1500.

The beauty of 1911s, aftermarket support is the best of any gun available. If you just want a shooter grade gun, don't be afraid to buy a used one. Worst case, you might have to replace a barrel and bushing to get really good accuracy. Later you can customize it with all sorts of stuff including grips, sights, beavertail grip safety, extended slide lock, thumb safety, trigger, mag release, and a host of other things.


1911crazy
October 26, 2005

I just looked at a well used, ridden hard, put away wet, 1911 in 45ACP. It was refinished/reblued. On it were wear marks that were the worst I have ever seen on the slide were the recoil spring housing goes into the frame. The slide is very loose. At what point is the 1911 worn out?

Now is this wear and seeing these marks the norm on a 45ACP? Or do some guns do have it and some don't? My Colts and Springfield Armory 1911a1's/1911's in the past never did this slide mark.


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