Building my 1911, everything seems to function perfectly. The trigger releases the hammer, the safeties work until...
I put on the slide and bring it all the way back. At that point the 1911 seems to go into auto-safety mode. The trigger will not release the hammer no matter what I try.
Any ideas what I am doing wrong, or more probable, what I need to file?
The disconnector prevents the sear from releasing if it is depressed by the slide.
I understand that, but when the slide is in it's normal battery position, it shouldn't be pressing down on the disconnector any more so the sear should release correct?
Right.
So before you rack the slide it works fine. Afterwards it wont release the hammer?
Maybe the disconnector is getting stuck in the hole.
That's what I was thinking, so I oiled it up and still the same thing. Maybe that's what I need to take the file to.
With the slide off, if you manually push down the disconnector, it should pop right back up.
I would check the disconnector with the slide removed. If it doesn't move freely, it may be a little oversized or have a burr on it. If it does move freely, take a little off the disconnector slot on the slide. Brownells sells a disconnector scraper. I made one and you can if your good at grinding tools. I'd do this rather than shorten the disconnector.
Are you using a Series 70 slide on a Series 80 frame?
Silly question I know, but I didn't see it asked in my brief scan of the thread. so I had to ask.
Assemble your gun without the grip safety and try to recreate the problem. Without the grip safety in the way you have full view of the trigger/sear/disconnector action.
Measure the height of your disconnector, top to bottom. Ideally it will be around 1.295 to 1.299. The minimum spec is 1.293 and max is 1.302".
I encountered this problem on both my 1911 builds and in both cases the disconnector was too long.
Thanks for the replies, I'll try your reccomendations and let you know. Keep them coming though.
As far as the series 70-80 response I'm sadly ignorant in that area.
I am using a KT Frame and a Sarco kit with a Brazillian slide. From my experience so far, the Sarco kit is what needs the work.
You should be good on the 70/80 if its a Brazilian slide.
A 80 series slide has a hole in the bottom for the firing pin block. Only colt makes this style.
Ok, more info didn't do all of the tests everyone suggested, and it appears that I may have been lying to you a little.
Slide off.
Trigger works, thumb saftey works. Grip saftey doesn't (I swear it did before)
I can pull the trigger all day, no problem, hammer drops.
As soon as I press down on the disconnector, it goes into auto-saftey mode. Nothing that I do will drop the hammer. The only way that I can get it to drop the hammer again is to remove the thumb saftey and the hammer. Once I put them both back on again, then things are back to normal.
I read somewhere that it is bad to let the hammer drop without the slide in place. something might break.
I don't know if it is true or not but thought I should pass it on.
Quote:
As soon as I press down on the disconnector, it goes into auto-saftey mode.
Nothing that I do will drop the hammer.
That tells me that your disconnector is binding. It could be a matter of simply adjusting your sear spring so that more preasure is applied to the sear/disc. but it's most likely needing some polishing or a little of both. Try to take some 220 (or 400) grit sand paper and polish the round part of the disc. (the part that slides up & down in the frame) and hit it with either a Cratex bit or felt bob in your Dremel tool to put a nice mirror shine on it. Don't neglect the frame here either, start with a rat-tail needle file if you can see burrs in it and just hit them until the hole is flush (don't go too crazy here - just remove any obstructions), then roll some strips of 220 sandpaper around a small piece of wire or dowl and do your best to also polish the hole in the frame, you may choose to progress to 400 and even finer if you want the same shine. KT's frames are brazed together so it's possible that some of the brazing has left a burr in your frame
The grip safety is another issue unrelated, if the leg is too short it's a throw away or it will need to be "peened" or welded to make it longer (much easier to just replace it) it could also be a simple spring adjustment if you can just bend the finger that pushes backwards to activate the gs and solve the problem - that's it.
Quote:
I read somewhere that it is bad to let the hammer drop without the slide in
place. something might break.
I don't know if it is true or not but thought I should pass it on.
This is very true, you will eventually break that hammer if you aren't stopping it from slamming into the frame. Brownells makes a gadget to help prevent this from happening (see photo) but if you're like me & would rather not spend the $25 you can make one by using one Weaver style scope ring with a 2" section of 1"Dia dowel rod locked in the ring like a scope would be, just clamp it the the frame rail like it would on a Weaver base and align the end of the dowl with the back of the frame & there you have it.
A few qestions, with slide off and all components in frame will gun function properly after you press in disconnector with thumb, IE will disconnector pop back up aggressively and then hammer fall when trigger pulled. I will tell you that the Sarco is not know for their quality control. If you continue to have problems I would suggest replacing the sear and disconnector with McCormick components which will probably clear up your problems.
Ok, I think that we are getting closer now.
First of all, I may not know the difference between a 70 and 80 series, but I don't let the hammer drop in full force. I have my thumb on it.
As far as Blindhogg's questions, I know that Sarco is not high quality, and boy do my files know it! The Sarco kit was a gift, and I will get it to work.
I took out the dial calipers, and the disconnector is not popping all the way back up after I press it down. Initially it is sticking above the frame in the .07" range. Once I press it down with my thumb, it only pops up to .05".
So where do I take the files to next?
Hold up on the files, First assemble your lower with the grip safety or beavertail removed. Now when you depress the disconnector you will see what happens, what is putting pressure for it to go back up is the sear spring. There could be many reasons it is not going back up. The ramp on the disconnector that mates with the sear spring could be rough or have burs, your sear spring might have a rough contact face, the disconnector as it goes up and down makes contact with the trigger which could also be hanging it up. You must understand how the part works and then figure out why it is not working properly. Or it could be something as simple as the sear spring might need to have its middle arm bent in.
Okay all, took off the beavertail and played with it again.
I'm sure that I will get some of these wrong, so have patience.
The longest leaf spring presses on the back of the sear. Everything works fine.
When I press the disconnector down, then the longest leaf ends up behind the sear, and nothing works.
Is this the proper behavior? By taking off and putting back on the hammer, these somehow forces everything back to it's original configuration.
I see that Blindhogg mentioned the sear spring, which one is that?
I had this same exact problem with my Sarco Kit.
I tried everything, and the final fx was to get a new trigger. The Sarco trigger was too long to let the disconnecter disconnect.
Sear spring = spring with three arms
Left arm of sear spring puts pressure on the sear at all times and should not slip off ever when it is in the proper slot in the frame and is captured by mainspring housing.
Middle arm of sear spring puts upward pressure on disconnector and is the return force for the trigger,
Right arm of sear spring is the beavertail/grip safety return spring.
quote:
When I press the disconnector down, then the longest leaf ends up behind
the sear, and nothing works.
Are you sure you are putting in the sear spring correctly?
The left spring arm is supposed to be on top of the sear.
If you are saying your left sear spring arm will not stay on the sear, then you have got problems and I suggest some new parts.
Ok, I took things apart again today, this time even took a picture.
It looks like I was incorrect in my previous statement.
The left arm of the sear spring always stays on the sear.
I might be getting closer since I figured out how to reset the disconnector.
So, If the hammer is down, or in half cock, disconnector will come back up. Only when I push the hammer all the way back, and press the disconnector does it stay down.
If I remove the hammer, and press the top of the sear forward, the disconnector pops up.
Here is a picture with the hammer off, and disconnector stuck.
You probably need to polish the engagement area of the disconnector. That angle on your disconnector is what the sear spring rides on and it must be smooth and polished. I also polish the middle arm of your sear spring so it will ride on the disconnector smoothly. You also might need to bend the middle arm of your sear spring in slightly to exert more pressure on the disconnector to help it stay up. Good luck
PS it kind of looks to me like the sear spring is hanging up on the top angled part of the disconnector angle. Polishing the sear springs middle arm on the end should do the trick. I polish mine with a nice radius to it
Uh, guys... Take a look at that pic again... The disconnector leaf is all the way up on the flat of the disconnector ramp. Either the bottom half of the disconnector is too long (not a whole lot you can do about that), or the disconnector leaf of the spring is too long. Either way, only option I see there is to shorten the disconnector leaf of the spring until it actually bears on the ramp.
Well if anyone else has a problem like this and runs across this thread, I finally have fixed the problem. I took it to a 1911 smith. He replaced the sear spring (I had done that once already) . That still didn't solve the problem. Then he pulled an old trigger of the shelf. That was the solution. Everything works. Well at least everything regarding this problem.
+1 Raven. Either the sear spring or disconnector is out of spec, too long. Or maybe just maybe the slot that locates the sear spring is a tad too high, the sear spring side is riding a little high too. Nah not on a Sarco frame... :;):