Alright, I have an STI (Edge) that I purchased a few years back and it positively EATS extractors. The first extractor broke within about 1000 rounds. I replaced it with an Ed Brown that went for about a year (~24000 rounds). I replaced that with a Dawson precision and that one never worked well at all (I blame my 'tuning' for that). Then another Ed Brown that went for about a month (~2000 rounds) and the damn thing died on me today during the second stage of a match. Now my matches don't go well when my equipment is failing. I'm just about willing to chalk this last one up to manufacturing defect, but thought I'd ask.
My cases are all sized on a case-pro, and the ammo I was running today had all passed a Saami gage, so it shouldn't be swelled cases or anything like that (which I suspect may have contributed to the first failure.)
Am I missing something else that may be contributing to premature failure, or is this just the way .40 extractors go? (I have .45 extractors that have seen well in excess of 100,000 rounds without issues.)
The .40 runs on quite a bit higher pressure than the .45 I believe, so perhaps it's sticking in the chamber, causing undue stress on the extractor hook? Just an educated WAG on my part.
Perhaps a good chamber polishing would be in order? I would try some Flitz Polish on a felt bob run at high speed in a Dremel or Foredom style motor tool. This may smooth out any minor roughness, which may be causing the case to stick.
I bet Gunsmith is on to something there, THere is definatly something else going on here besides just extractors failing. I would if it were me chase your chamber with a finishing reamer to clean/open your chamber to spec. THats where I would start
When you install the next extractor, also make sure that it is of the proper length and not riding on the case in front of the rim. I've had to shorten them before to make sure they get positive and full contact with the rim. I run the AFTEC advanced competition extractor (brownells part number 466-001-040) in all my competition guns. Those things are bullet proof. The extra $$$ is well worth the peace of mind during a comp stage. I hate equipment failure during a match. Throws off all my timing.
I'll check the chamber today, maybe look into reamer rental. The extractor fitting has been good.
I actually own an Aftec and depending on who you talk to they're either the best or worst extractors made. I'm ready to give it a try, but I think it's something systematic, and not really the extractor.
Send it to me, I will do it for the cost of return shipping. It should only take me about 2 mins.
Thanks Chris, that's a very gracious offer!
I'm going to try to get it going myself though, as it's match season and having it gone for even a week means missing practice and a match. (I know, having it mess up my match doesn't do much for me either, so I know I'm rolling the dice.)
Where is the extractor failing? Second the idea of checking that they aren't too long and running into the barrel.
I run AFTECs on all my USPSA guns, two at around 30,000 each with no problems.
On the last two the hook (business end) broke clean off (not just a chip.) The original broke back at the Series 80 cutout. (Another reason the series 80 business was a poor idea.) I'd never seen one fail there before and it threw me. I was having failure to extract during a match and I stopped and looked in at the extractor and the hook looked fine! After the stage the RO said he could see the extractor hanging on to the shell during the firing cycle, but of course they can't say anything...
If you're planning to run the gun in competitions while troubleshooting the extractor issues, perhaps you should buy an extra extractor or two. Just put one in the gun on competition day, so that you're running an extractor with as little use as possible, and change it out for an older extractor when practicing or troubleshooting. If your extractor gives out way too early, the second new extractor should keep you running long enough for a replacement to ship. This isn't really a solution, but it should at least keep your gun running during matches.
Do you use the extractors stock, just as they come out of their package, or do you tune them up before use? If the former you might want to give them a tuning to insure that they're not just doing the job but doing it as well as possible. Since the problem keeps happening it could be an indication that the problem isn't with the extractor at all, but with something else. Is there any indication that the nose of the extractor is contacting the back edge of the barrel? If so, a light filing to the very tip of the extractor would shorten it up just enough to keep that from happening. Is there a tight fit of the firing pin stop in the extractor notch, or is there a bit of play (ie, the extractor can move forward and backward ever so slightly)... if so you might want to replace the firing pin stop with one that fits better. Do you use a stock guide rod and standard recoil spring that's the right size for the caliber? Could be something as simple as a slightly lighter spring or the addition of shock buffs would tame whatever it is that's causing your extractors all their grief. The point is there has to be something that's causing them to break... find whatever it is and the problem will disappear. Just some thoughts.
Yep, I've been looking for that systematic problem that's breaking extractors, but so far with no luck. I tune my extractors before they're installed to feed (rounding the bottom and I check their fit with respect to the barrel during lockup. (No contact, the hook fully engages the rim, but theres no contact forward of the extractor nose.) No interference with the barrel and I tune 'em to 2.5# tensions as measured with Weigand gauges. There's no play between extractor and firing pin stop. (I had play with Dawson extractor and that resulted in unreliable extraction, but no breakage. And it's just STI's, this pistol and I broke a single extractor in my competition back-up gun - I've never broken an extractor in anything else. I have an extractor in right now (Ed Brown) that seems to be working (Two matches and a practice session ~600 rounds total, so far) but can't find a clue as to what might be causing the issue. I have an Aftec ready to install, but I want a new firing pin stop before doing so, as it has to be modified to work.
Hi Gene... ~600 rounds on that Ed Brown extractor and no problems... is there a message there? If you're getting consistent and reliable extraction with it AND it isn't breaking, AND it's allowing you to complete matches without fail it seems to me that you've found one that works. Changing to the Aftec just because it's supposed to be a superior product and it's what lots of other competitors are using can't be outweighed by the fact that, for whatever reason, it doesn't perform in this particular pistol as well as that EB extractor does, and that's really all that should matter.
It's almost analogous to what benchrest shooters do with ammo... they shoot as many brands as possible knowing that there's probably going to be one that groups better than the others with their favorite rifle. If it turned out that they could shoot 1/2" groups with "Joe Blow's Fancy Bullets" but couldn't get under 3/4" with Winchester, Remington, CCI, Federal, etc, etc, I'm pretty sure they'd show up at their matches with their JBFB cartridges in their plain brown wrappers and not be ashamed when they take home the gold.
I know, that's a bit of an over-simplification, and it would be nice to know why those Aftec extractors are breaking, but when the chips are down and you need your gun to function, if it does it with an EB extractor, well, so be it. Buy a spare or two, JIC, and go with what works. Makes sense to me.
Nope. The last extractor that broke was an EB too, and it ran fine for ~2,000 rounds. The one before that was an EB and it ran for ~26,000 before breaking (I still consider that premature). Before that STI. (In between I tried Dawsons, but I could never get them to even extract reliably, so I didn't keep 'em in long enough to break.) Rest assured I won't install the Aftec unless this EB breaks. I don't really care for the Aftec design, but if the others are going to be a problem I'm willing to try Aftec. I'd be happy with any extractor that worked well.
I've never run an Aftec, so they're not the ones breaking (yet!).
Maybe its an STI thing; I had an Edge 5.0 but it was unusual in that it was .45 caliber instead of the normal .40, but it too broke the hook off its extractor (at a match of course). Aftec dropped in & had no further problems.
Even if it's an STI thing, there's got to be a reason - I just can't figure out what it is. CBR, your experience is interesting because I was wondering if it was a .40 thing. (My .45's - all Kimber - have never had a problem.) Maybe it is STI. I have noticed that when tuning for the STI I have to remove material from the 'heel' (The bump that sits behind the rim.) and I normally don't have to do that when setting a .45 extractor.
Anyhoo, the Aftec is waiting in the wings and will get its' chance if/when the current extractor goes.
I had one malf at this weekends match, but didn't stop to examine it, so I don't know what caused it (failure to feed). Came in first in class, second overall in limited.